Log of the #fcrepo channel on chat.freenode.net

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awoods: if we start backporting features, who is going to do that work?09:08
awoods: It means we'd be supporting multiple versions concurrently
awoods: I don't think we have enough committers to do that
dchandekstark: ^^^09:09
<dchandekstark>acoburn: I understand, except this is bug fix, not a feature09:10
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<acoburn>dchandekstark: it would be great if we had enough developers to support multiple branches of fcrepo. I think we'd need more people to step forward to make that possible09:12
<dchandekstark>acoburn: I hear the problem, but perhaps we also need to consider slowing down?09:13
acoburn: Surely you're not saying we only support 4.6 and not 4.5?09:14
<acoburn>dchandekstark: we first need a completed API specification and a TCK, then we can talk about maintaining separate branches
dchandekstark: and yes, I'm saying that once 4.6 is released, I wouldn't expect there to be support for the 4.5.x branch
<dchandekstark>but now?09:15
<acoburn>just like there is no support for the 4.4 branch
the repo isn't structured to support a 4.5 branch
<dchandekstark>right, but 4.5 is the current release branch
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<acoburn>yes, but there are breaking changes in master
<dchandekstark>or not branch, but current version
<acoburn>we'd need to create a 4.5.x branch off of the 4.5.x release and put changes there09:17
I'm saying, someone would need to do that work: who would it be?
<dchandekstark>acoburn: Any reason we can't do that?
<acoburn>no reason not to. But again, WHO would be maintaining that branch. It wouldn't be me
as an example — the camel tooling will soon be moved over to support the new message serialization09:18
meaning all that will become incompatible with 4.5.x and before
<dchandekstark>acoburn: I understand, but sounds there may be some work to communicate the version support policy to the community09:19
acoburn: we're not currently using camel fwiw
the particular bug that started this is painful09:20
<acoburn>That's fair, but I think that _has_ been communicated — that until we achieve a certain stability in the definition of the Fedora API (meaning a spec and TCK) we can't really talk about a LTS version
<dchandekstark>it's a serious problem
acoburn: can you point me to a statement related to version support?09:22
i'm trying to find one one ...09:23
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<dchandekstark>upshot is, given that we're currently committed to 4.5 and no clear idea when we will be able to move to 4.6 we need support for 4.509:24
i'm willing to do what i can to help
if that's what it takes :)
<acoburn1>I'd suggest attending tech calls and asking for LTS of particular versions09:25
and then providing support to maintain those versions
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<dchandekstark>acoburn1: ok, will try to make the next one09:26
<awoods>dchandekstark: fyi: https://wiki.duraspace.org/display/FF/Policy+-+Previous+Versions+Support09:28
<dchandekstark>awoods: ouch09:29
<awoods>acoburn1: I share your concern about supporting multiple branches. I also see a 4.5.2 bugfix release being relatively lightweight.09:31
dchandekstark: It would be great if you and your team could be more involved on the Fedora side.09:32
<ruebot>awoods: if you need help getting 4.5.2 bugfix release out relatively quick, i can hop in and help where needed.09:33
<dchandekstark>awoods: Looks like we're going to have to be :)
<awoods>dchandekstark: For example, this patch which you reported has not been verified: https://jira.duraspace.org/browse/FCREPO-2053
<dchandekstark>guess i have to fir up eclipse :(
<awoods>dchandekstark: or IntelliJ09:34
ruebot: thanks, let's see how this plays out.
<dchandekstark>awoods: yes, i haven't forgotten about 2053
<ruebot>awoods: ...should we talk about that policy on the next call? it looks like it hasn't been updated since it was written. so, we didn't have the conversation again in oct. 2015. ...unless i am mistaken09:35
<dchandekstark>although the problem may have been a side effect of ISPN lock wait
<awoods>dchandekstark: If we are talking about a 4.5.2 release, it would be nice to know if 2053 goes in or not... but that boat is about to pass.
<dchandekstark>ruebot++ on revisiting the policy
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<awoods>ruebot: please add it to the agenda
<ruebot>awoods: sure thing!09:36
<acoburn1>awoods: IMO, a 4.5.2 release would need to start at the 4.5.1 release tag, not current master
<dchandekstark>awoods: seems like we can leave 2053 unresolved for the moment
<awoods>acoburn1: completely agree
<dchandekstark>it's not been happening
acoburn1: certainly
<ruebot>awoods: did a page get created for the next meeting?09:37
<awoods>ruebot: I would have to check...
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<awoods>ruebot: There are no secret pages
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<dchandekstark>awoods: no, but sometimes they're hard to find
<ruebot>awoods: you just copy and paste the previous one to the create the new one, right?09:40
<awoods>ruebot: correct
<ruebot>awoods: i shall do that.
<awoods>ruebot/acoburn1/whikloj: here are the potential bugs for a potential 4.5.2: https://jira.duraspace.org/issues/?jql=project%20%3D%20FCREPO%20AND%20issuetype%20%3D%20Bug%20AND%20status%20%3D%20Closed%20AND%20fixVersion%20%3D%20%22Fedora%204.6.0%2209:41
ruebot: please
<acoburn1>awoods: are suggesting they get back ported?
awoods: some of those were pretty big changes09:42
<awoods>acoburn1: I am suggesting that is the complete list of candidates for backporting.
* ruebot hopes he did that right
<acoburn1>awoods: got it
<awoods>ruebot: thanks09:44
<ruebot>awoods: np! always happy to lend a hand :-)
<awoods>ruebot: You have consistently shown that to be true. Thank you.09:45
<whikloj>awoods: sorry are we discussing backporting or cutting a 4.5.2 release?09:48
<awoods>ruebot/acoburn1/whikloj: If we are able to get enough community engagement to support previous 4.x releases, I would suggest such support be limited to bugfixes.09:49
whikloj: both
<acoburn1>awoods: yes, bug fixes only++
<awoods>whikloj: backporting bugfixes on top of the 4.5.1 tag as a 4.5.2 release.
<ruebot>awoods: agreed. bug fixes only.
<whikloj>awoods: oh okay, that seems like it could be a lot of work09:50
<acoburn1>awoods: but here's the question: fcrepo-1754/fcrepo-1498/fcrepo-1983 was a huge fix
awoods: backporting that will be a nightmare
<whikloj>awoods: so definitely only bugfixes
<awoods>ruebot/acoburn1/whikloj: which implies, only non-breaking backports.
<acoburn1>awoods: and seriously, the rebasing for a lot of these is going to be pretty intense09:51
<ruebot>awoods: well, do we classify the types of bugfixes that get backported?
<dchandekstark>awoods: Might be good to include version semantics in ver support convo ?
<ruebot>et al: it is definitely a sustainability issue09:52
<acoburn1> no, no, no
that won't work with maven
<awoods>acoburn1: the severity and complexity of the potential bugfix/backport list would need to be reviewed, certainly.
<dchandekstark>acoburn1: except the second ver number indicates breaking
<awoods>ruebot: what type of classification do you have in mind?09:53
<acoburn1>awoods: but the question becomes this: if someone fixes a bug in master, who decides whether it gets back ported?
<awoods>dchandekstark: 4-digits will not work with maven.
<whikloj>and do we need to have PRs for a set of past versions as part of the work?09:54
<acoburn1>awoods: mainly, I am worried about the time I spend on this — if I need to support back porting bug fixes, it will severely limit the number of bugs I take on
<awoods>dchandekstark: https://wiki.duraspace.org/display/FF/Fedora+4+Semantic+Versioning
<ruebot>awoods: i'm honestly not sure. i'm sympathetic to acoburn1's sustainabilty comments. it's it something we just have a conversation about when it arises? is that too naive?
<awoods>acoburn1: the committers decide
<whikloj>awoods: and considering how many bugs acoburn1 fixes, I'd prefer to not burden him
<acoburn1>awoods: as it is, I need to be very conscious of the amount of time this takes
awoods: basically my rule is this: does (or will) the bug affect Amherst? if it does, I'll work it. If not, then probably not09:55
awoods: that means basically, I have no interest in working past releases09:56
awoods: if someone else wants to do that, though, more power to them!
<awoods>ruebot/acoburn1/whikloj: This question would be somewhat simplified if we had more tooling for moving content in and out of the repo.
<ruebot>awoods: that is a very good point.09:57
<acoburn1>awoods: isn't that what /fcr:backup does?
<awoods>acoburn1: That needs verification
acoburn1: escowles has verified /fcr:backup/restore for a relatively large repo.09:58
<acoburn1>awoods: that sounds like verification to me
<awoods>acoburn1: I have also asked dchandekstark to verify: https://jira.duraspace.org/browse/FCREPO-206909:59
dchandekstark: would you be available to participate in the release process of a 4.5.2?10:05
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<dchandekstark>awoods: will do my best
<awoods>dchandekstark: would you be available to verify release-candidate artifacts on a ticket by ticket basis?10:07
<dchandekstark>awoods: probably, that should be doable in the short term
<awoods>dchandekstark: that would be very helpful.
dchandekstark: on the other hand, ideally you would be able to deploy on 4.6.010:11
dchandekstark: I would have to look through the issues closely, but I suspect the "breaking changes" in 4.6.0 will not impact you.10:12
<dchandekstark>awoods: i think we're certainly open to 4.6.0 if the upgrade is not inordinately complicated :)
<awoods>dchandekstark: what would it take for you to verify that the current master is a "drop-in" replacement of your current deployment?10:13
<dchandekstark>awoods: we have fairly extensive test suites for our hydra code10:14
if that's what you mean
i expect we'd have to upgrade one or more hydra components
<awoods>dchandekstark: do you have customizations at the Fedora level?10:15
<dchandekstark>i doubt the version of ActiveFedora we're on is compatible with 4.6
awoods: you mean Java code?
<awoods>dchandekstark: yes, Java.10:16
<dchandekstark>awoods: No
just config - JNDI for ISPN
and MySQL twekas10:17
<acoburn>awoods: the "breaking changes" involved removing the /fcr:export and /fcr:nodetypes endpoints
<awoods>dchandekstark: perfect
<dchandekstark>acoburn: we're not relying on /fcr:export
<awoods>acoburn: exactly, which dchandekstark does not care about.
<acoburn>that _shouldn't_ affect activeFedora
<dchandekstark>we're on AF 9.8.2 i believe
<awoods>dchandekstark: I suspect 4.6.0 will be sufficient.
<acoburn>awoods: since we're not changing to MODE5, 4.6.0 will be a drop-in replacement for pretty much everyone10:18
<awoods>acoburn/dchandekstark: but we need a three-week release-candidate testing cycle.
acoburn: agreed
<acoburn>(unless someone was actually _relying_ on the JCR export facility)
<awoods>acoburn: I doubt it10:19
<acoburn>awoods: me too
<awoods>dchandekstark: can you wait three weeks?
<ruebot>whikloj: we'll have to look at those endpoints https://gist.github.com/ruebot/7233a27f7c6d8cd85deb95d692f090cc10:20
<awoods>dchandekstark: or we could make a deal: 4.5.2 with your single bugfix now-ish, and your engagement with the 4.6.0 release process starting next week.10:21
<ruebot>whikloj: no results on them for /fcr:nodetypes
<dchandekstark>awoods: that sounds reasonable10:23
awoods: re 4.6 - this would be a transition off ISPN, right?10:25
some kind of export/import required?
<awoods>dchandekstark: no
<dchandekstark>awoods: oh, ok10:26
<awoods>dchandekstark: getting off of ISPN comes with a Mode5-based release... which will not be 4.6.0
<dchandekstark>awoods: that's good, in a way
i mean, we're certainly seeing ISPN-related issues that appear to be independent of Fedora/ModeShape10:27
<whikloj>ruebot: all of those are because we are mocking a Fedora response
ruebot: like https://github.com/Islandora-CLAW/chullo/blob/master/test/GetGraphTest.php#L67
ruebot: So we can just update our test with new fake Fedora Response, or do nothing.10:28
<dchandekstark>awoods: before we do an export/import i think we need to clean up some post-migration snafus
<awoods>dchandekstark: that makes sense
dchandekstark: although testing export/import may be possible even if the data is not perfect.10:30
<dchandekstark>awoods: sure
in particular, we have some dangling child refs10:31
that i'm worried about
there are also some nodes seem to be behaving badly but quietly
awoods: i was disappointed to find that apparently modeshape does not provide tools to check the repository for consitency issues10:33
unless y'all know of something
gave up here: https://developer.jboss.org/message/922619#92261910:37
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[fcrepo4] awoods created 4.5.2-RC (+1 new commit): https://git.io/vK3ko
fcrepo4/4.5.2-RC 1e3f7af Andrew Woods: Allow resources that are referenced by other versioned resources to be deleted...
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<awoods>dchandekstark: are you currently using the core fcrepo-webapp.war or fcrepo-webapp-plus.war?11:25
<dchandekstark>awoods: i think just core, lemme check with coblej11:26
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[fcrepo4] awoods deleted fcrepo-4.5.2-RC-1 at e0dfe52: https://git.io/vK3Ig
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<dchandekstark>awoods: yeah, i think core11:29
at any rate we're not using audit or webac at the moment
<awoods>dchandekstark: I will have a release-candidate war for you in about 10min
<dchandekstark>awoods++ youdaman
awoods: coblej faked me, we are using fcrepo-webapp-plus11:30
awoods: but w/o audit and webac11:31
<awoods>dchandekstark: do you know which exact artifact from webapp-plus? https://github.com/fcrepo4-exts/fcrepo-webapp-plus/releases/tag/fcrepo-webapp-plus-4.5.1
<dchandekstark>awoods: fcrepo-webapp-plus-4.5.1.war11:32
<awoods>dchandekstark: thanks
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<f4jenkins>Yippee, build fixed!11:46
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fcrepo4/fcrepo4#4559 (fcrepo-4.5.2-RC-1 - 1e3f7af : Andrew Woods): The build passed.
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<ajs6f>awoods: If we could get Archiva or Nexus someplace, we could have Jenkins lay down SNAPSHOTs regularly. I know we just agreed yesterday that we don't want to run a lot of Maven gear, but I distinguish between us-providing-dependencies and us-providing-our-own-snapshots.11:50
<awoods>ajs6f: currently we are publishing snapshots on every commit11:51
ajs6f: ..through sonatype
<ajs6f>awoods; Can you not point dchandekstark at that, or am I missing something?
<awoods>ajs6f: we only publish based on master
ajs6f: dchandekstark needs an RC branch11:52
<ajs6f>awoods: Okay, I clearly don't understand what the need is. NM.
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[fcrepo-webapp-plus] awoods tagged fcrepo-webapp-plus-4.5.2-RC-1 at 0ca6d5a: https://git.io/vK3Om
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[fcrepo4] acoburn pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vK3O8
fcrepo4/master 058c564 Andrew Woods: Update source headers to not require annual update (#1062)...
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[fcrepo-transform] awoods created 4.5.2-RC at 708db4c (+0 new commits): https://git.io/vK3OF
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<ajs6f>afk bbl12:24
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fcrepo4/fcrepo4#4560 (master - 058c564 : Andrew Woods): The build passed.
Change view : https://github.com/fcrepo4/fcrepo4/compare/4c9d8c3e1408...058c564d6642
Build details : https://travis-ci.org/fcrepo4/fcrepo4/builds/143371873
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[fcrepo4] awoods tagged fcrepo-4.5.2-RC-1 at b08dc4f: https://git.io/vK3Wj
fcrepo4/fcrepo-4.5.2-RC-1 64a5159 Andrew Woods: Allow resources that are referenced by other versioned resources to be deleted...
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[fcrepo4] awoods force-pushed 4.5.2-RC from 1e3f7af to 64a5159: https://git.io/vK3lJ
fcrepo4/4.5.2-RC 64a5159 Andrew Woods: Allow resources that are referenced by other versioned resources to be deleted...
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awoods: Do we have a release manager for 4.6.013:15
<awoods>ajs6f: no... interested?
<ajs6f>awoods: Sure, always happy to help.13:16
* ajs6f stares at himself in shock and unmitigated horror.
<awoods>ajs6f: done
ajs6f: that would be great
<ajs6f>awoods: Wait until you see what kind of job I do.
awoods: We may very well end up releasing a 3.x version.13:17
<awoods>ajs6f: we will try to avoid that
<ajs6f>awoods: get ready to sound like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01RbUVcZncg13:18
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fcrepo4/fcrepo4#4562 (4.5.2-RC - 64a5159 : Andrew Woods): The build passed.
Change view : https://github.com/fcrepo4/fcrepo4/compare/1e3f7af9fbcf...64a5159b0f41
Build details : https://travis-ci.org/fcrepo4/fcrepo4/builds/143384847
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acoburn: am I remembering correctly that 4.5.2 contains the change in WebAC to use URIs for acl:agent?14:02
<acoburn>peichman: I have no idea what 4.5.2 contains. I'd assume that it doesn't14:04
peichman: 4.6.0 _will_ have that change
<peichman>acoburn: oh, okay
acoburn: no rush, we are just planning for when we need to change from stings to URIs
<acoburn>peichman: you won't _need_ to change from strings to URIs, it's just that 4.6.0 makes it possible to use URIs14:05
I think the word on the street is that a 4.6.0 release candidate will be soon — next week maybe?14:06
a full release will take at least 3 weeks of review
we can adjust our planning accordingly14:07
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<ajs6f>awoods: For release management, you want only committers to do that, right?14:22
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[fcrepo-module-auth-webac] awoods opened pull request #68: Update source headers to not require annual update (master...fcrepo-2066) https://git.io/vKsWx
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[fcrepo-module-auth-xacml] awoods opened pull request #51: Update source headers to not require annual update (master...fcrepo-2066) https://git.io/vKsle
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[fcrepo-mint] awoods opened pull request #4: Update source headers to not require annual update (master...fcrepo-2066) https://git.io/vKslz
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[fcrepo-audit] awoods opened pull request #36: Update source headers to not require annual update (master...fcrepo-2066) https://git.io/vKsl2
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[fcrepo-transform] awoods opened pull request #24: Update source headers to not require annual update (master...fcrepo-2066) https://git.io/vKslV
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[fcrepo-webapp-plus] awoods opened pull request #37: Update source headers to not require annual update (master...fcrepo-2066) https://git.io/vKslw
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