Log of the #fcrepo channel on chat.freenode.net

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[fcrepo-import-export] awoods pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/v1IFg
fcrepo-import-export/master d501256 Nick Ruest: README fix (#46)
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[fcrepo-camel] acoburn opened pull request #137: Remove RdfNamespaces class (master...fcrepo-2318) https://git.io/v1Lkc
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<acoburn>ajs6f: quick question: the MODE impl has support for some Fedora-defined Prefer headers (inbound refs, child resources, server-managed resources)14:13
ajs6f: the spec seems to be silent on these extensions14:14
ajs6f: will it continue to be silent on this?
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<ajs6f>acoburn: No, I just hadn't dealt with that. Thanks for reminding me14:15
acoburn: inbound links will be a SHOULD.
<acoburn>ajs6f: and embed resources?
<ajs6f>acbourn: that's contained resources?
<acoburn>ajs6f: yes; there seems to be some confusion about whether that's a recursive operation14:16
ajs6f: i.e. just one level of child resources or more
<ajs6f>acoburn: That's a should. In the distributed case, we don't know that contained resources are in any lsense locl.
local
I don't know whether it is local.
<acoburn>ajs6f: thanks!
<ajs6f>If someone tells me what it is, I will write it in.
<acoburn>if someone tells you what? whether contained resources are local?14:18
they certainly won't be (not necessarily) in the impl that I am imagining
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<th5>I get the basics of what Fedora (core?) provides. So Hydra is a framework for making Fedora clients, right?14:54
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<ajs6f>th5: Not so much. Hydra is a Ruby on Rails system that uses Fedora to present relatively simple applications. You will get more help with your question in #projecthydra.15:35
<th5>Thanks. Little hard to understand what these projects are / how they fit together, much less make informed decisions about them.15:52
<acoburn>th5: actually, I don't think Hydra uses IRC anymore — there is a slack channel, but I'm probably not the one to ask about how to sign up for that
<ajs6f>Sure. There are different communities that overlap. Hydra is independent of Fedora organizationally, but not on the technical level. There are other systems of a similar nature, most importantly Islandora.15:53
<th5>acoburn: Appreciate the slack recommendation. Haven't seen much (any) discussion in the hydra irc channel after lurking there for some time.15:55
<acoburn>th5: http://slack.projecthydra.org/
<ajs6f>ruebot:whikloj: where do people go for islandora things? #islandora?15:59
<whikloj>islandora.ca
or #islandora
<acoburn>or #islandora on IRC
<whikloj>acoburn++16:00
or https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/islandora
<acoburn>or https://github.com/Islandora-CLAW/CLAW/wiki
<ruebot>ajs6f++ whikloj++ acoburn++16:03
<ajs6f>islandora++
<ruebot>th5: kinda a timely question given the fedora camp happening right now.16:04
* th5 is at the camp
<ajs6f>th5: can you see awoods?
Andrew Woods?
<th5>sure can
<ajs6f>Wad up a piece of paper, throw it at him, and then tell him it came from me.16:05
<th5>he's smirking now
haha np
<ruebot>ajs6f++
th5: oh, then i won't tell you too look at the presentation with no context :-) https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1wwvxeNLqgThoFo0q3BL44hDg8kPId4lVMoPtybt6Tu8/edit#slide=id.p
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<ruebot>th5: if you're trying to evaluate both and get a handle on what each do, the mailing lists and irc/slack are problem the best places to interact with each project16:07
s/problem/probably
<ajs6f>th5: And you _do_ want to do some interacting, because you'll make a much better decision if you talk to "everyday" users of each framework and not just the kind of power user who leaps to answer questions in IRC channels.16:08
<th5>ruebot: I'll have to review it again. The slides/sections of the pres describing each made sense. Not crystal clear to me how they compare to each other.
ha ok
ajs6f: That makes sense. Will reach out and learn more about common use cases/etc.16:09
<ruebot>th5: well, they are wildly different and the wildly the same at the same time :-)
<ajs6f>They're just WILD.
<th5>Right now I have many diff repos. Picked out DSpace as best among them. Press from lib to jump to hydra/fedora as magic fixall. Trying to see if that actually makes sense for us and if so how to proceed.16:10
<ajs6f>Hydra is like riding a bear over a waterfall while drinking a keg of mead, but Islandora is more like riding a sabertoothed cat across desert sand dunes while firing a machine gun into the air.16:11
Both good, just in different ways.
Nothing, absolutely NOTHING to do with Fedora is a magic fixall.
<whikloj>Both apparently involving being some sort of cowboy
<ajs6f>whikloj: No, just being awesome.16:12
<th5>ajs6f++++
<whikloj>ajs6f++
<ajs6f>th5: Seriously, you want to be able to enunciate very good reasons to use Fedora itself before even considering the question of whether to use a toolkit and if so, which.
th5: Fedora is expensive to run, very powerful, and demands a lot of thought.16:13
th5: It can do things no other repository software comes close to being able to do, and it will put you on the forefront of technology in this field.
th5: But you will have to invest time and effort to get the benefits.
th5: be sure you know what are trying to get out it FIRST.
Don't use Erlang when Bash will do fine.16:14
<acoburn>but if you're going to write a distributed, fault-tolerant system, use Erlang16:15
<th5>Totally makes sense. Not sure it is best fit for us. I think part of it is that since it's so powerful, could meet all possible needs. Need to revisit requirements to see if could go with "good enough" simpler solution
<ajs6f>th5: That sounds like an awesome idea. Maybe not as cool as riding a bear while the bear rides a sabertoothed cat, but also less likely to end up with you covered in blood.
acoburn: it's your job to do the Erlang impl. I'm still working on the Haskell impl.16:16
acoburn: And we still need to get someone to do the OCaml impl.
<acoburn>ajs6f++
<th5>ML 4 Life!!!16:17
How about Sufia (or HyBox which whole community seems to think will be a magic bullet)? How turnkey can it really be? So far everything I see is more like a toolbox to roll your own repo16:18
<ajs6f>th5: Yyyyyyep.
th5: Here's the thing: the great strength of Fedora is what we just touched on— it can do a lot. An awful lot. If you cover over that power/flexibility/customizability, you are not going to be able to use it. If you do not cover over that power, it is not going to be simple or turnkey to use16:21
(Not able to use it meaning use the flexibility)
So the notion of a turnkey Fedora system isn't impossible, but it does raise the question: what is the advantage of it over simpler solutions.16:22
<th5>That makes sense. Really appreciate the sanity check. Trying to cut through hype/hand waving.16:23
<ajs6f>Yeah, if there's one thing I associate with awoods, it's mad hype. He's like the Don King of repository software.
From his outlandish appearance to his wild gesticulations.
<ruebot>if you're looking for something simple and turnkey, dspace is your huckleberry. if you're looking for something more robust and turnkey, islandora 1.x is your huckleberry.16:24
<ajs6f>ruebot++
<ruebot>if you're looking for a framework to take care of a bunch of use cases, hydra is your huckleberry
<ajs6f>The nice thing about Islandora is that it exposes a nice balance of simple and extensible.
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<ruebot>if you want the latest and greatest and turnkey, wait for CLAW and HyBox.
<ajs6f>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YVTksxZMOA
<ruebot>and maybe CLAW will be a wrapper for HyBox or HyBox will be a wrapper for CLAW :-)
<whikloj>Ahhh Val Kilmer is there anything you can't do
<ajs6f>Make the power of Fedora available without the responsibility to learn to use it wisely.16:26
No one can do that.
<whikloj>But if anyone could it would be Iceman
<ajs6f>True.
<ruebot>but...16:27
<ajs6f>Or possibly his character from Real Gneius.
Genius
<th5>best kilmer flick next to Heat
space lasers
<ajs6f>I thought Heat was a remake of Real Genius?16:28
<ruebot>i think the use cases and requirements for our colletives communities unfortunatly are asking Val Kilmer to be Batma, Doc Holliday, Iceman, and Elvis from True Romance at the same time
and also, Lazlo
<whikloj>hahahaha
<ajs6f>ruebot++
Heez, was he Batman, too?16:29
<ruebot>YUP
Batman Forever
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<ajs6f>Man, EVERYONE has played Batman. I would like to see awoods as Batman.
But what villain would dwilcox play?
<ruebot>ajs6f: well, dwilcox would have to be Nightwing or Jim Gordon16:31
<ajs6f>ruebot: Yeah, no offense to dwilcox, but he's just not very threatening.16:32
<th5>in person discussion just revealed existing vigilante psychopath style of duraspace team - no costumes just yet16:40
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